Spinoff from SAHMs in sweats

Ok, Adrianne has taken a lot of heat around here. A lot. Thanks for sticking around, Adrianne. A lesser woman would have fled. You've got some heuvos, girl. I was checking out the discourse between Tracy M and Adrianne over at Dandelion Mama (seriously you guys, check it out. I'm too lazy to post a link, just click on the sidebar, and dig through the August archives. It's Tracy's very first post.) There has been a lot of talk about how young Adrianne is, and she said something on Tracy's blog about how her opinion shouldn't be less respected just because she is 22. Hmm. She might be right about that. But then again, she might not. My older sisters read this blog occasionally, and the oldest one, a fantastic pillar of the faith who has definitely been through some serious motherhood battles, says that she just has to laugh at all of us young moms, twiddling about this and that. "Just live a little bit longer, and you'll get it!" she says. My visiting teacher said the same thing. I ranted and raved about some catastrophic mess that befell my house because Jacob is 3, and she said, "I've got a mop and some cleaning supplies. Those problems, I can fix. Little kids, little problems. Big kids, big problems." And her accounts of trying to curtail her teenager's underage drinking and drug use shut me up real fast. I'll take fingerpainting with poop any day over substance abuse, thank you very much. So should we dismiss our problems because we are young? Does being young really mean that we don't know anything? We are all dumb and naive at some point in our lives (some longer than others, to be sure), but that's something that usually, we can't really help. It's not Adrianne's fault she's 22. Now, of course, if young people have stupid ideas, just because they're young, does that mean we should talk them out of them, or should we just wait until they're old? Should we try to educate each other, or just let each other learn as we go, and hope nobody has to go the hospital because of anything too stupid along the way? And don't hesitate to comment because you're young. Or old. Or crazy. We take everything except spam. Just don't call anybody a JackAss. With that, dear friends, I'm going to bed. Finally. In my sweats. Which are still dirty.


Blogger Adrianne said...

Thanks Heather, I appreciate this post. Obviously I have taken a lot of heat from these SAHMs, and that's all fine and dandy but stick to the issue. Just because I am 22 does not mean I don't have a clue about life. I could sit here for hours and tell you about the struggles I have had the tough decisions I have had to make. How many 18 year olds do you know decide they want to move to another country, because they appreciate a free market, or how many 20 year olds do you know get married? I can tell you I graduated with both my B.A, and M.A in 5 years, and could list you off my credientials as a social worker, or as a woman, or as a wife, or as a nanny, but I will just be met with "She is young and naive". Being older is not nessecarily a ticket to being smarter, and being younger is not a ticket to being dumber. While you might not agree with my personal blog, it is definitley outside of the scope of most "21 year olds". I was 21 when I started that blog, and no it does not cover issues about clothes, and make up, and superficial topics, my blog covers a lot of political/social topics and cultural topics. If you are going to disagree with something, great,terrific, but just come out and say why you disagree, not that you disagree because I am 22.

11/03/2005 10:30:00 AM  
Blogger Karen said...

Sometimes in life it is easy to be put together, and sometimes it is not. It just depends on what you are dealing with. Sick? Pregnant? sick kids? older kids struggling friends, school? special needs child? Finances? (I know I buy for kids first) We all have different priorities at different stages of our life.

Adrianne- I don't think your comments come from being young and naive. I just think you chose the wrong place to comment on SAHMs. And really, being a nanny is not the same thing.
Why don't you write a post on how people (male and female, all ages) don't seem to care what they look like. I see slobs of all ages around, not just SAHMs.

11/03/2005 11:17:00 AM  
Anonymous Matt Jacobsen said...

Heather, I think your sister's words are wise. We should all live a little more and we'll get it. Sometimes we get so caught up in the problems of the here and now that we lose perspective of our real lives and the problems of others. I try to remind myself to think of what will be important in 20 years about what I do today.

For me, the stress of worrying about little things is just too draining. Even big problems that may require more worry and stress are not worth it because I need all my energy focused towards facing those problems, not being diverted into self-abosorbtion about my lot in life. Some people seem to operate well under stress, or at least get that extra drive that they need, but not me.

So whether one is 12 or 22 or 42 or 82, a little patience will go a long way.

11/03/2005 12:12:00 PM  
Blogger The Wiz said...

Well, my main problem is that clearly Adrianne is not getting enough traffic/attention on her own blog, so she feels the need to come over here, and post comments specifically designed to create a reaction.

This is not the forum for it. It's our blog, a Mommy Mormon blog, not hers. She has her blog. Everyone is as free to go over there as they are to come here. It just seems that we get more traffic than she does, so to get her reactions and her traffic, she comes here.

11/03/2005 12:14:00 PM  
Blogger Adrianne said...

You know I should mention this post was not centered on me wanting to see more put together, moms. It was centered on being more in tune with yourself, your body and your self esteem. It is about self improvement, and it is about being a good mom. Because if you dress sloppy and feel bad about yourself you are not sending your child the right message. In the future I won't send links to my blog about these topics, but I was trying to be helpful by saying "Look, take time for you too, you matter".

11/03/2005 12:14:00 PM  
Anonymous Beanie said...

"or how many 20 year olds do you know get married? "

Ummm...I know several people that have gotten married by the time they were 20...it's not that uncommon.

11/03/2005 12:35:00 PM  
Blogger Adrianne said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

11/03/2005 12:39:00 PM  
Anonymous Emily said...

cat fight anyone?

11/03/2005 01:02:00 PM  
Anonymous Chad Too said...

I'm not going to step into the Adrianne fray. Y'all can work that out amongst yourselves.

Regarding the original post: When I was a high-school aged seminary student (in Utah, so it was fourth period and not some UNHOLY hour of the morning!) one day the teacher told us the topic for tomorrow would be, "Can a 16-year-old be in love?"

I thought about that a lot. I knew I had the hots for a girl named Kathy, but I wasn't in love with her (though I wouldn't have minded trying. She had the most goregous deep brown eyes!) I knew my friend Angela and her boyfriend Mike had been together for two years and I figured they were in love. I also thought of an elderly couple I home-taught where the wife was in the final stages of Alzheimers and her husband devotedly cared for her even on days that she didn't know who he was.

Can a 16-year-old be in love? Yes, but only 16-years worth. Do I understand what it means to be a father? Yes, but only 8.75 years worth. It's neither good nor bad, it's a process.

Fights over the last cookie will evolve into fight over when to do homework (our current dilemma) and I anticipate other fights to come as he grows. Enjoy three while you have three, because four will be here soon enough and three will never come back no matter how you wish it colud.

11/03/2005 01:11:00 PM  
Blogger Adrianne said...

One thing I do want to clear up is the discussion of me coming on here to "troll" "fight" or "get more traffic on my own blog". Pardon me?? I think it was the other way around.

I did not even know this blog exsisted until one day I googled my name and found a post on here bashing my blog and my posts. I could care less what anyone blogs about but did think it was rude that people here had all out attack on my blog and thoughts. Still I accepted the attack. I never once invited anyone to find my blog, they found it and teared it apart. So no I was not looking for traffic but since there were posts on this blog pretaining to me I felt the need to defend myself. I do not any longer.
As per your wishes I will not post here again.

11/03/2005 01:20:00 PM  
Blogger Carrie Lundell said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

11/03/2005 02:32:00 PM  
Blogger Carrie said...

I got married at 18. Does that make me better or worse than Adrianne?

11/03/2005 02:39:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I googled my name

Yeah, Adrianne, you're not self-centered at all! I'm not yet a mother but even I don't have time to sit around all day and google myself.

11/03/2005 03:16:00 PM  
Anonymous Emily said...

Oddly enough, this has been a very interesting read - I've worked with men, live with a man (my hubby) etc. for so long I forgot the uh.."art" with which women fight. We can be vicious devious creatures when our buttons are pushed can't we? Sometimes I really just prefer the outright directness of men you know.

In all honesty, this is my attempt to shift the discussion here, but I do really miss the usual light heartedness of this blog - I've stopped reading so many before because of the I'm right, you're right battle it out intellectually thing that so many blogs fall into. I hope that this one doesn't head that way.

11/03/2005 05:04:00 PM  
Blogger Heather O. said...

Ok, let's analyze what's going on here.

In all fairness to Adrianne, she is right that her post about SAHMs being slaves was picked up by me and posted about here without her knowledge. Mea culpa, or whatever. I thought it was an interesting topic and wanted to share it (ok, that could be a euphemism for "it made me so spitting mad I couldn't type a response fast enough," but I digress!). Adrianne at that time did not have a comments section on her blog, which is why I brought that particular discussion over here. But I understand that she has enabled that particular feature now, so people are welcome to go over there and continue the cat fight, erm, I mean discussion. (Yes, Emily, women can be vicious!)

Adrianne did draw our attention to her post about SAHMs because, yes, she wanted to generate traffic on her blog (c'mon, what self respecting blogger doesn't?), but also because she wanted some genuine discussion on it. She then took the original post down because she realized, I think rightly, that it had a very offensive and insulting tone. She still wanted to discuss the issue, because it is one she clearly feels strongly about, so here we are.

Karen said, "I just think you chose the wrong place to comment on SAHMs."

In all fairness to MMW, Adrianne did deliberately bring the discussion over here, and as I asked before, Adrianne, I'm not sure what kind of response you expected. Mothers can be defensive and protective creatures with a pack-like mentality, for better or for worse, and you seemed to deliberately want to pick a fight. Clearly, you got one. I'm not saying that was your original intent. In fact, I don't think it was, but it came across that way, hence all of the defensive statements.

But this original post (from which I feel we have strayed a little bit) was not meant as a dig at you, or your age. I was hoping for a more general discussion about how we treat people and their decisions based on their ages, and how inevitable naiveity (sp?) of life plays out in different scenarios. I'm sorry that you have felt attacked on this thread, because that certainly was not my original intent, either.

Ok, end of longest comment EVER!

11/03/2005 05:40:00 PM  
Blogger Heather O. said...

One more thing-

MMW does not specifically ban people just because we disagree. I hope, Adrianne, that you don't forsake us forever, because I do think that discussions we could have from such different viewpoints could be productive-granted we could all keep our claws sheathed (not pointing paws here, just making a general statement).

11/03/2005 05:46:00 PM  
Blogger Heather O. said...

And Emily, never fear about this blog becoming too intellectual. Having one scholar in the family is enough. My job in life is to make DH remember that the world does include other things besides things like Newtonion cosmology.

Ok, ok, I'm shutting up already!

11/03/2005 05:50:00 PM  
Anonymous Susan M said...

I missed the whole controversy, but that's ok. I just want to say Adrianne has a good point about taking time for yourself. I think the bit about spending that time doing your hair and makeup is ridiculous, but whatever floats your boat.

BTW, I was married at 18, and a mother of three by age 24. If that gives me any street cred.

11/03/2005 07:32:00 PM  
Blogger Lisa M. said...

I think that the older I get, the less I know.

(I missed the whole controversy thing too.)

11/04/2005 02:48:00 AM  
Anonymous Emily said...

I don't mind the intellectual banter, its when it heads into a "I'm better/smarter than you are tone" that I leave.
As far as your original topic on age, I think that you do gain maturity with age because of lifes experiences. Flatly, someone who is 18 will not have the same experiences as someone who is 60, but they can BOTH learn from each other.

11/04/2005 04:10:00 PM  
Blogger annegb said...

At my age, comfort is king. I wear pajamas (sometimes the really cute ones, sometimes not), I wear cotton nightgowns, and I wear housecoats.

My young neighbor, who just turned 30, is a little shocked that I go out to feed the dogs in my nightgown. I am more covered than a lot of people and I don't think I'm too exciting to look at. We get along. Everybody teases me about my pajamas and I laugh along with them.

I like my cute ones better, but just so long as I don't have a bra on, it's all good with me.

11/04/2005 09:28:00 PM  

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